Meend and a moving bridge.

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StVitus
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Meend and a moving bridge.

Postby StVitus » Sat Sep 10, 2016 5:46 am

On a sitar it’s normal to be able to bend a note four or five steps. It’s also normal for the bridge to be resting on a smoothly varnished wooden top. So bends can move the bridge. What’s the solution? There must be a way to keep this from happening. Because Irshad Khan bends like Jimi Hendrix on brown acid and I don’t hear his bridge popping out of place.

I assume that I can’t just drill holes and peg the bridge in place like on guitars, or Indians would have started doing so long before I was born. Do I glue the bridge in place? Or should I just put some discreet marks under the bridge to show where it should sit to intonate properly in the tuning I use and move it back after playing?

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kalyan
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Re: Meend and a moving bridge.

Postby kalyan » Sat Sep 10, 2016 11:33 am

hi,
I usually put a couple of drops of shelack right on the foot of the bridge where it meets the face. it works because when the shelack dries it holds like a light glue, but also because the alcohol on the wet shelack softens the existing shelack and the feet of the bridge will sink into the finish. these days most sitar makers no longer use shelack ( french polish) instead they use lacquer or polyurethane the shelack can stick to it but not nearly as well. So you may need to try a white glue and water mixture. Mix some white glue with water till it thin enough to drip of a pencil that has been dipped it then drip one drop on each corner of both legs right at the point where the legs meet the face. do this one spot at a time while holding the sitar in a manner that will allow the drop flow down lengthwise towards the opposite corner of the same foot it will seep under the bridge foot (repeat for the othe 3 corners). This should give you a bit more purchase. Do NOT use wood glue or super glue because you need to be able to remove the easily in the future. allow it to dry for 20 min or so before trying to meend.
Small bone pins are some times used along the ma string side of the bridge but they can get in the way when you are trying to make adjustments.
I hope that amkes sense and helps
Good luck
Kalyan

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barend
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Re: Meend and a moving bridge.

Postby barend » Sat Sep 10, 2016 12:04 pm

Yes you can use light glue like Kalyan is saying. But I think there is no need to glue the bridge if it is properly fitted. The string tension will hold it in it's place even with big meends. On both my sitars the bridges are not glued and I never have a moving bridge. Having a non glued bridge makes it easier for set up adjustments that are needed from time to time.

Lars
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Re: Meend and a moving bridge.

Postby Lars » Sat Sep 10, 2016 7:08 pm

I've set up and refitted many hundreds of instruments. Sometimes the bridge will stay put but I always use shellac drops on the edge like Kalyan. It keeps the bridge in place and easy enough to remove if you don't overdo it. I don't like the pins, they're often used when the structure won't accommodate the 5+ note meend requirement due to angles, langot placement, etc.

Some bridges just slide around, from what I've figured out it has more to do with the tabli shape and the flare of the legs and of course how slippery the finish is underneath unless it has been cut away. Also if your position on the langot and nut slot isn't aligned it's more likely to happen.

Lars
http://www.raincitymusic.com

StVitus
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Re: Meend and a moving bridge.

Postby StVitus » Sun Sep 11, 2016 6:15 am

Is there a particular brand of shellac that works well?

Lars
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Re: Meend and a moving bridge.

Postby Lars » Sun Sep 11, 2016 5:35 pm

StVitus wrote:Is there a particular brand of shellac that works well?


Try Zinsser Bullseye orange shellac. It's pre-mixed and you can find it at Home Depot, etc. They use methylated alcohol so don't sit in a room with it for long as that stuff is toxic. I mix my own shellac with grain alcohol since I'm around it sometimes a bit and it's not unhealthy, unless you drink it ha ha...

Lars
http://www.raincitymusic.com

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povster
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Re: Meend and a moving bridge.

Postby povster » Thu Sep 29, 2016 6:40 am

barend wrote:Yes you can use light glue like Kalyan is saying. But I think there is no need to glue the bridge if it is properly fitted. The string tension will hold it in it's place even with big meends. On both my sitars the bridges are not glued and I never have a moving bridge. Having a non glued bridge makes it easier for set up adjustments that are needed from time to time.


Hey Barend! Knowing you, your sitars are French Polished? I think the modern hard varnish/urethane type finish on many sitars yield to pressure differently. By that I mean there is a "softness" to a French Polish that allows the bridge to sink into that finish a bit and grip as opposed to slipping across a harder urethane type finish.
...Michael
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rex@sitar.co.za
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Re: Meend and a moving bridge.

Postby rex@sitar.co.za » Sat Oct 01, 2016 3:15 pm

Hi Everyone,

Instead of glue, you can just insert some strips of latex "shelf-liner" rubber between the bridge legs and tumba.
It doesn't affect the sound at all, there's no bridge slippage, and no glue.

- Rex

barend
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Re: Meend and a moving bridge.

Postby barend » Sat Oct 01, 2016 5:08 pm

povster wrote:
barend wrote:Yes you can use light glue like Kalyan is saying. But I think there is no need to glue the bridge if it is properly fitted. The string tension will hold it in it's place even with big meends. On both my sitars the bridges are not glued and I never have a moving bridge. Having a non glued bridge makes it easier for set up adjustments that are needed from time to time.


Hey Barend! Knowing you, your sitars are French Polished? I think the modern hard varnish/urethane type finish on many sitars yield to pressure differently. By that I mean there is a "softness" to a French Polish that allows the bridge to sink into that finish a bit and grip as opposed to slipping across a harder urethane type finish.


I am not sure. I have a Barun Roy and a Hari Chand sitar.

barend
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Re: Meend and a moving bridge.

Postby barend » Sun Oct 02, 2016 9:17 am

rex@sitar.co.za wrote:Hi Everyone,

Instead of glue, you can just insert some strips of latex "shelf-liner" rubber between the bridge legs and tumba.
It doesn't affect the sound at all, there's no bridge slippage, and no glue.

- Rex


You mean anti slip mats like this?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NON-SLIP-MAT- ... 1983421330?


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