Materials about surbahar technique

This is for discussions on the Indian sitar and surbahar, This includes films, books, and recordings

Moderators: povster, s1owpoke, cabernethy, coughcapkittykat

seepersaudc
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue Jan 29, 2013 2:38 pm

Re: Materials about surbahar technique

Postby seepersaudc » Fri Feb 10, 2017 6:04 am

Chandrashekar Naringrekar was trained by Ziamoiuddin Dagar the great rudraveena player. . That is all I know! Z.M Dagar really is so clean and no fluff in the sruti and note combinations. It's amazing....

CheesecakeTomek
Posts: 519
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 6:19 pm

Re: Materials about surbahar technique

Postby CheesecakeTomek » Fri Feb 10, 2017 6:23 am

Ok, yes - I thought that might be the case.
Yeah, it doesn't get much better than Z.M. Dagar... to my ears, at least
Thanks!

barend
Posts: 989
Joined: Sun Jan 15, 2006 10:38 pm
Location: the netherlands

Re: Materials about surbahar technique

Postby barend » Fri Feb 10, 2017 10:19 am

seepersaudc wrote:In all honesty I believe Pushpraj K. Surbahar sounds awful. His jawari in a few live videos I saw sounded so flat and didn't ring long at all.

My surbahar was played by Chandrashekar Naringrekar who has great recordings of surbahar on YouTube.


I think it is matter of taste. PK has a much more closed jawari sound whereas CN has a more open buzzing sound. Same if you compare say Z.M. Dagar with Asad Ali Khan on veena. ZMD has a more closed sound and AAK a very buzzing sound. I like both sounds and one is not better than the other. It's more in the hands of the player.

StVitus
Posts: 131
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2016 3:43 am

Re: Materials about surbahar technique

Postby StVitus » Fri Feb 10, 2017 8:12 pm

seepersaudc wrote:Shall I make a compare and contrast video? My sitar is ib C# and surbahar in F#. I can explain differences with video and sound.

What questions would you like me to address?


I don’t even know enough to know what to ask! Maybe you could show things that a beginner should learn to do, or learn not to do.

Are you able to tune so low because your instrument was built before touring musicians reduced the size of the surbahar?

seepersaudc wrote:Being a person with both instruments and a teacher...
The main difference between surbahar and sitar is TEMPERAMENT.
Surbahar takes so much effort to meend and hold and stroke and even tuning (reaching the pegs is not easy)---
But the reward is huge.


I feel like meend on surbahar is easier than sitar. I get more leverage and the string doesn’t cut into my finger! But reaching the tuning pegs is an uncomfortable stretch.

seepersaudc wrote:Surbahar has a round warm dark tone.
In all honesty I believe Pushpraj K. Surbahar sounds awful. His jawari in a few live videos I saw sounded so flat and didn't ring long at all.


I think Koshik’s sound is just different. It’s a very mellow tone that suits his slow, meditative style. Naringrekar has a much livelier sound that suits his playing style, which is more fanciful.

waseem
Posts: 12
Joined: Sun Apr 05, 2015 12:54 pm

Re: Materials about surbahar technique

Postby waseem » Sat Feb 11, 2017 9:57 pm

For educational sake I would like to point out some recordings of my guru-ji (Ashok Pathak) on the surbahar. He has been trained as a sitar and surbahar played both in the khyal and 'Dhrupad/Been ang'. I am currently learning to play this instrument as well in that style (there is a bit of historical info here: http://www.ashokpathak.com/music/surbahar).

Also, if you catch this in time and you are around in Europe he has a Surbahar concert coming up on Feb 26th 2017 in belgium: http://www.ashokpathak.com/agenda

Darbari Kannada:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTu5xbL_gcI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mi0B7U1_d1E

Malkauns & Bageshri
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jdRTz3i9CKM&t=3639s

Also, you can instal spotify on your desktop (for free) and listen to Bhimpalasi on surbahar
https://open.spotify.com/artist/4laA6y5EYbme8wzvFXqhIn

Unfortunately guru-ji does not have many recordings online, a situation that gets hopefully rectified soon.

User avatar
musicslug
Posts: 246
Joined: Wed Jul 12, 2006 6:43 am

Re: Materials about surbahar technique

Postby musicslug » Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:53 pm

a few things in response to all the above:

- I regularly pull meends from G to D on the jordi (2nd string) without any issues, likewise from D to R on the pancham, M to Ni on kharaj. of course string gauge is a factor.

- whether you use mizrabs or not, or multiple mizrabs, and the style (e.g. Dhrupad) you study, will likely depend on your teacher (you can adjust the jawari, e.g. increase the 'buzz' by opening the jawari if you're playing with fingernails or the pads of your fingers instead of mizrabs. lots of variables.

- the 'foot' is pretty much invariably not going to be right for the user; you'll almost always have to come up with your own fix (I added height to my first one, made a kind of 'cradle' for it on my 2nd). (I like getting the balance so that it doesn't tip even when my right arm isn't resting on it.)

hope this helps!

Winemaker
Posts: 15
Joined: Sun Sep 04, 2016 12:00 am

Re: Materials about surbahar technique

Postby Winemaker » Thu Feb 23, 2017 9:23 pm

I would really appreciate some beginner material you think it's aprópiate to start with, even if they are sitar exercises but whatever you consider a total beginner needs to learn surbahar. My instrument arrives today, I'm anxiously waiting , meanwhile I could look for some instructional videos or exercises. I know a teacher is the best , I will go to one soon but he lives very far from home so meanwhile I could start somewhere.

Thanks a lot I already appreciate the comments in this post .

Namaste

User avatar
musicslug
Posts: 246
Joined: Wed Jul 12, 2006 6:43 am

Re: Materials about surbahar technique

Postby musicslug » Fri Feb 24, 2017 12:41 am

be super careful starting out; if you develop bad habits (e.g. incorrect hand position), not only are they hard to break later, they can put you at risk for repetitive motion injury. I get that you're impatient, but try to hold off until you meet with your teacher.

StVitus
Posts: 131
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2016 3:43 am

Re: Materials about surbahar technique

Postby StVitus » Sat Mar 04, 2017 7:05 am

I have a very specific technique request. Would someone post a photo showing how I’m supposed to put the foot of the surbahar on/against my own foot to prop it up? At this point I’m convinced I’m doing it incorrectly, because if the foot is just on the floor the angle of the instrument is just too low.

By this I mean I cannot hold the surbahar like this:
Image

Mine has a bird-shaped foot that sticks out of the instrument at what would be three o’clock if the instrument was upright.
Image

So I’m assuming that the bird goes on top of my foot, but I’m not sure about that. Or was it just installed in the wrong place? It seems like this would fit if I moved it so the foot is between four and five o’clock.

mizrable
Posts: 80
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 3:09 am

Re: Materials about surbahar technique

Postby mizrable » Sat Mar 04, 2017 2:14 pm

if that foot is removable maybe try taking it off and playing your instrument beside you with the gourd resting in a tabla ring. you can also try playing with the foot postion using velcro.

StVitus
Posts: 131
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2016 3:43 am

Re: Materials about surbahar technique

Postby StVitus » Sat Mar 04, 2017 7:28 pm

Thanks for the velcro suggestion. That is a great idea.

mizrable
Posts: 80
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 3:09 am

Re: Materials about surbahar technique

Postby mizrable » Sat Mar 04, 2017 7:52 pm

thank Lars!

Lars
Posts: 1337
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2006 6:05 am
Location: Seattle, WA
Contact:

Re: Materials about surbahar technique

Postby Lars » Sat Mar 04, 2017 11:33 pm

mizrable wrote:thank Lars!


What did I do?....

As for the surbahar if you change the position of the footrest make sure the wood backing is inside the gourd for it to screw into otherwise you might be attaching it to just the gourd and it'll crack and come loose.

Lars
http://www.raincitymusic.com

StVitus
Posts: 131
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2016 3:43 am

Re: Materials about surbahar technique

Postby StVitus » Sun Mar 05, 2017 12:51 am

I worked it out. Tony mentioned that he made a cradle for his surbahar to rest in. I simplified that idea by cutting a 4x4x1 in square of pine and then chiseling out a notch for the foot to rest in.


Return to “SITAR & SURBAHAR”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests